Persona 5 - Niijima Makoto - Kaitou ver. with Jo...Persona 5 - Niijima Makoto - Kaitou ver. with Johanna (Amakuni)

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© Amakuni / Katagiri Katsuhiro

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55hace 24 díasAcid08Acid08
LOL wow that pose is terrible.
54Hace 6 meses (hace 23 días)AzukayAzukay
LOL Only the bike is there. Obviously, she had to go to the restroom guys. She'll be back.
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0hace 1 díaJunAresJunAres
I mean on the one hand, the post is terrible for Makoto.
On the other hand, it still looks nice if you disregard her personality. So long as a good Makoto figure that fits her personality comes out, I am fine with this.
3hace 5 díasskmmskmm
I hope they'll still modify her pose before the final product! It's so OOC for Makoto, and she's my fave of the lot too! ><
7hace 12 díasTattsunsTattsuns
Ah? this pose just killed the whole cool attitude, i'm disappoint, i love Makoto, but this is not looking like her to me :(
14hace 15 díasriringoriringo
AkibaMelon (hace 15 días) #24407620View spoilerHide spoilerWhy is it though, that everywhere I see the P5 fandom taking place e.g. Twitter etc., I read comments like "waifu this", "best girl that"? I think you really underestimate fandoms these days. Ever seen how fans engange in writing fanfics, creating fan art etc? None of that is 'in-character' but it's what fans love to do, getting their imaginations on with their favourite characters. I have no doubt that there are a whole bunch of folks who simply enjoy the game and take no interest in waifus and husbandos or whatever is hot at the moment (like me for example ^^) but who do you think is buying all the merch - the keychains, cellphone straps, mini towels, clearfiles, plushes, laneyards etc? Certainly not the occasional fan. All of this merchandise as well as figures will simply cater to those who are most enganged in the franchise, those who will spent their hard earned cash on what they idolise the most.
See, I'm not interested in a fight. There are apparently 2 very different kinds of people here: Those who like her and those who don't. And I'm pretty certain I'm not gonna convince anyone of the opposite side here, I'm not intending to either. But it really bothers me that some people have such die-hard beliefs that they apparently can't take another opinion. I certainly do get all of your guys' points - I just don't agree and am not afraid of saying so. There's no need to use words like 'fallacious', 'appalled', 'jfc' or start writing in caps just because I don't share your beliefs.
I normally don't get into these kind of arguments because they eventually lead to nothing but I've been seeing this kind of discussion on mfc again and again and was somewhat tired of it. And no, just because it's "90%" of (visible) ppl complaining on here does not neccessarily make it right. Those who like and appreciate her might just not engange in this argument and just quietly put her on their wishlists (which is what 503 people did to this point).
To get back to real figure discussion though, I just wanna say that I'm very interested in how she eventually turns out, especially her paint job. Really excited to see how they bring out the different textures (of her suit, of Johanna etc) Probably gonna subscribe to the pictures only though instead of the comments from now on ^^;

Maybe we're in very different circles but literally no one I know takes this waifu stuff seriously. This, on the other hand, is supposed to be a pretty "serious" figure, that's obvious based on the work and the steep cost it will have. Others might see it differently, but that's how it is for me because I don't have the luxury to throw $150+ around for jokes. I don't think keychains, charms, mini towels, etc. can really be compared to a scale figure in terms of degree of commitment (like I wouldn't really think too hard about buying a keychain, but it would take much more time to decide if I wanted to preorder a figure).

I'm not fighting with you. Like I said, people are free to like this AND THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT, but this pose being incongruent with her personality (of how she's been portrayed in the games and promo materials) is a fact. I've liked figures that were OOC as well, but I would never go into the comments to defend the OOCness, because there's nothing wrong with preferring another depiction of a character. If someone said "Yeah she's OOC, but I like her this way", I would have nothing to say.

And you're right, 90% of commenters might not be a completely accurate indicator of how many people actually like/or dislike it, but it is a pretty good reflection of general opinion. If you go to the comment section of well-liked prototypes, the comments are almost unanimously positive, mixed prototypes have mixed commentary, and so on. Every figure will have its positive and negative comments, but the ratio is a pretty good indicator of general consensus.

naikousei (hace 15 días) #24408892View spoilerHide spoilerhttps://i.ytimg.com/vi/foqYfrzKows/maxresdefault.jpg
Alright, ya got me.
1hace 15 días (hace 15 días)ronrironri
@naikousei: Thanks! Oh and unless you're directly addressing points, I do recommend minimizing the quotes (or replacing it with "snip") so we avoid cluttering the comments section. ^_^

As for the figure itself, I have very little doubt that the painted prototype will turn out bad especially given how Ann's prototype looked so far. Pricing shouldn't be an issue for me especially if it's Makoto.
2hace 15 días (hace 15 días)naikouseinaikousei no Tabi
ronri (hace 15 días) #24409615...

Well said!

I hate that we, as fellow collectors, aren't even "allowed" to keep said figures being discussed on our wishlists without getting called out. :c

I have a huge problem with Ann's portrayal, and Makoto's even moreso (obviously) but like you, I'm holding out hope for even minor changes in the case of Makoto. I'm resigned to Ann's pose and current design with this manufacturer, and believe me, I'm VERY much on the fence regarding purchasing it.

The game made some HUGE mistakes. They constantly contradict themselves. I guess it's understandable, then, that some would glance at these designs and not see a problem.

That in itself is problematic, like you said, though.

I'm not trying to argue, just genuinely in disbelief at some of what I'm reading.

Opinions are opinions, though, and this admittedly isn't the place to get super in-depth about anything other than the figures themselves.

And hell, I don't think I've ever met a more vocal group than anime fans, haha. XD

Let's see what happens when she's painted. Maybe they'll surprise us with some minor tweaks, who knows.
1hace 15 días (hace 15 días)AkibaMelonAkibaMelon
ronri (hace 15 días) #24409615...
I'm afraid you're reading a bit too much into my comment :D I never tried to say that companies shouldn't bother with anyone but the waifu crowd. Believe me, if I had any say a lot of my favourite character's figures would look a whole lot different XD But at the end of the day, merchandise is made for those who consume it the most passionately. The whole popularity argument is not really valid either imho, just look at the Fire Emblem figures of Tharja and Camilla, two popular girls from a vastly popular franchise who themselves alone would have sold like hotcakes but the companies sexed them up to a point that let some fans be upset about as well and yet they still sold like hotcakes XD The fact that this fig looks the way it does kinda proofs my thesis no?

Of course one can be upset about that and demand for something else but the sheer outrage really surprised me. As if it was new that companies put out figures in bathing suit versions, sexy poses etc. The whole outcry just really caught me by surprise. Hence the 'trashbag' comment which is obviously meant as an exaggeration you know?

But for now lets agree to disagree ^_-

DeepEyes (hace 15 días) #24408647Well said, I'm one of those people just watching bored on the sidelines this "fight"... Very interested in the figure just worried for the price since Johanna will increase it.
Thanks :) I agree abou the pricing. Ann came with quite a price tag already but Makoto is certainly a whole other caliber. If the price wouöd be along the lines of Motorbike Saber I wouldn't really complain ^^ (but since she was released in a time when figure prices were generally way lower, I kinda doubt that >.>)
6hace 15 días (hace 15 días)ronrironri
AkibaMelon (hace 15 días) #24407620snip
To be fair, you're implying that fandom output (fanart/fanfics/social media comments etc.) and the resulting merchandise all lead back to waifu and/or otaku culture, which is admittedly worrisome. I mean you're practically operating on a zero-sum mentality wherein companies shouldn't even bother catering to other kinds of fans beyond the "waifu crowd". I'd understand your bewilderment if this was announced to be a fanservice-type figure from the get-go and people are still complaining, but given the initial teaser image they used and how Persona 5 isn't even overtly sexual in its treatment of Makoto's character, well the fact that some might have a problem with this is actually perfectly understandable.

When it's a character as dynamic as Makoto who's entire personality and motifs cover a wide range of ideas, it's hardly surprising that many would flock to such a character, e.g. prim and proper student council president by day and phantom thief by night, studded metal rider with tones of a post-apocalyptic Wild West, justice-seeking law enforcer with a penchant for street vigilantism etc. At that point, while catering to the waifu/otaku crowd is surely the easy route, it's most certainly not the ONLY one. Also needing to cater to a specific crowd for the sake of guaranteed sales is somewhat redundant when said character is popular enough to consistently rank as the 2nd highest favorite character across multiple Persona 5 poll rankings, just behind the main protagonist himself.

Again, not everything has to be on a zero-sum scale as if it has to be "one or the other". I mean, I'm not entirely fond of the chosen pose for this figure, but my liking for Makoto combined with own experiences allow me to feel comfortable enough to still order this figure. And that's while still being able to laugh at the ridiculousness of the chosen pose, haha! ^_^
2hace 15 días (hace 15 días)naikouseinaikousei no Tabi
riringo (hace 15 días) #24405610No, wasn't mad. I was APPALLED because what you said -who else would figure companies pander to, if not the waifu crowd- doesn't make sense. P5, while people might joke about waifus, isn't actually about waifus. If Makoto were in a dating sim, this pose would make more sense.

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/foqYfrzKows/maxresdefault.jpg
2hace 15 días (hace 15 días)naikouseinaikousei no Tabi
SIGH.

[ext link ]

I have a feeling those that really need to read articles like these... uh, won't, but maybe it'll help shed some light on things. This focuses on Ann at large, but there are several that delve deeper into others' portrayals as well. You can see, then, why poses such as Makoto's make the situation 10x worse and all the more disgusting. We're arguing about a figure, but these issues are even more prevalent in day to day life. Most men, and some women even, have a hard time grasping the concept. If they don't personally experience sexism, it must not exist or be a problem... right?

Ultimately though, everyone should really just take a gender theory course because this is about way more than a character from a video game at this point.

Also, I'm dying inside.

After finishing Persona 5, I immediately remembered that when asked about whether true friendship between people of another sex can happen, producer-director Katsura Hashino responded: “I’ve never successfully forged a true friendship with a girl in real life. I guess that means we couldn’t implement it into the game because we don’t know what it’s like.” Suddenly, Ann’s treatment made a lot more sense to me.

That's just sad, no matter how you look at it.

This figure is about as objectifying as it can get when you consider the character it's portraying (rather, trying to and failing miserably) and goes against EVERYTHING said character stands for in-game. (Ann and her figure treatment is even more of a mess in some ways, but that's another rabbit hole I'm not about to jump into.)

Fin.

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